Excluded files(sectors?)

[Azrael]

Since i've updated from 5.0 to the 6.1 version i' ve noticed the apparition of a lot of excluded files, spread all over my C partition , and a few on the others. What are those? System files or bad sectors on my hd?

[Luc J. Patenaude]

Must be new to this latest instalment of ISD Beta 6.1, read on then.

 

As soon as you see the box with the down arrow into it and, having the mention of 'Defrag Only', select the down arrow in order to get the second option. This one, is called: Defrag and Optimizes. This one not only defragments all of the files onto your HD, it also performs the 'speed-me-up Scotty!' of all files onto your HD(System files and in use files also). It will defrag your HD to absolute 0.00% Fragmentation status.8)

 

Patience, once again, will be in order, as it will take way over an hour to do just so.

:grin:

[Azrael]

Not that new.

 

I'm using Iobit defragmenter since the beta 2.0 version so i know how to perform a Defrag and Optimize - before that was the Auslogics (for 2 years). FYI my hd has had less than 2% fragmentation for the last 3 years.

My problem is totally different: because it's a very old install (4 years) and cloned thru 3 hd's my system files (MTF and pagefile) have become fragmented. I've managed to defrag the pagefile but the MTF totally refused to budge so i decided to do a full clean (erasing the empty space with the ideea that the MTF will be reduced) with Restoration. Bad ideea: not only it didn't have any effect on the MTF size but running SmartDefrag 5 (used 5.1 once and abandoned it - no Optimise) i discovered that the free space has diminished by 10% even if everything looked ok (0% frag, no problem files or sectors). I upgraded to the last version(6.1) and after the Analyse a lot of black Excluded appeared on the graphical representation of the hd, spread all over the hd, clustered around the location occupied by the pagefile in 5.0. BTW the lost free space is still lost.

So, again, this is a problem on my hd (busted sectors, logically or physically), some hidden files that SmartDefrag cannot handle or a bug in SmartDefrag ?

[enoskype]

Hi Azrael,

 

Try to reduce the space occupied by System Restore.

Most of the files there, will not be defragmented by defragers, if you don't use Offline (system files+MFT+Metadata) defragmentation.

 

Go to:

My Computer=>right click=>click Properties=>click System Restore=>click Settings=>slide the bar closer to Min=>click OK=>click OK

 

BTW, you can use one of the defragmenter's (such as PerfectDisk) offline defragmentation to defrag the system files, MFT, and Reserve space for MFT enlargement, etc., by using it in trial time (full functional).

By default, in XP, MFT reserve space is 12.5% of the disk space.

 

I would advice you to read the posts in thread "Think About Defragmentation" in Lounge section.

 

I hope this helps.

 

Cheers.

[Luc J. Patenaude]

Busted HD? Do not think so. Will have to reFormat it that's all.

 

ISD Beta 6.1 is not bugged to that point. It is your HD's partitioning table that is totally out-of-whack.:sad:

 

Just backup your most important files and programs and, use your O.S. disk for reFormatting it into a proper to use partition table. ReInstall your O.S. +Service Packs+all online updates/upgrades then, reinstall all programs that you use/like most of all others. You can reinstall all others at a much later time. :idea:

 

Now, install ISD Beta 6.1 and, use it at Defrag and Optimize right-a-way.

You should get a 0.00% status after its completion.

:wink:

[solbjerg]

Hi Azrael

Have you run a full Check Disk in Windows? What does that say?

Cheers

solbjerg

 

I'm using Iobit defragmenter since the beta 2.0 version so i know how to perform a Defrag and Optimize - before that was the Auslogics (for 2 years). FYI my hd has had less than 2% fragmentation for the last 3 years.

My problem is totally different: because it's a very old install (4 years) and cloned thru 3 hd's my system files (MTF and pagefile) have become fragmented. I've managed to defrag the pagefile but the MTF totally refused to budge so i decided to do a full clean (erasing the empty space with the ideea that the MTF will be reduced) with Restoration. Bad ideea: not only it didn't have any effect on the MTF size but running SmartDefrag 5 (used 5.1 once and abandoned it - no Optimise) i discovered that the free space has diminished by 10% even if everything looked ok (0% frag, no problem files or sectors). I upgraded to the last version(6.1) and after the Analyse a lot of black Excluded appeared on the graphical representation of the hd, spread all over the hd, clustered around the location occupied by the pagefile in 5.0. BTW the lost free space is still lost.

So, again, this is a problem on my hd (busted sectors, logically or physically), some hidden files that SmartDefrag cannot handle or a bug in SmartDefrag ?

[Azrael]

Clarifications

 

Enoskype - System Restore has been disabled from the day i installed XP;

- i already used Diskeeper with no result, my MTF is still in two and the excluded files are still there;

- as i said i've had less than 2% defrag for the last 3 years ; always at shutdown i run AWC beta with it's defrag unit active and now the frag is 0%.

Luc J. Patenaude - if it's this way then why 5.0 has showed all clear - no problems, no excluded files? These files have appeared only in 6.1 ;

- i didn't work so hard for 4 years to keep my system alive and kickin' to throw the towel because of a non lethal problem

- At this moment (and since i'm using the AWC beta) my frag is 0% on all 4 partitions

solbjerg - twice: from cmd and from AWC beta / System Utilities with the same result - absolutely no errors. BTW in HDDLifePro the hd health is at 100%.

This is how it looks http://i341.photobucket.com/albums/o368/Azrael-srl/SmartDefrag1.jpg and http://i341.photobucket.com/albums/o368/Azrael-srl/SmartDefrag3.jpg - attention, on the D partition everything is OK, i didn't screw anything. As you can see the black excluded files are there. What are they? Are they connected to the fact that i lost some free space without any reasonable explanation?

[solbjerg]

Hi Azrael

How does it look if you use Defrag&Optimize for the defragmentation?

Cheers

solbjerg

 

 

Enoskype - System Restore has been disabled from the day i installed XP;

- i already used Diskeeper with no result, my MTF is still in two and the excluded files are still there;

- as i said i've had less than 2% defrag for the last 3 years ; always at shutdown i run AWC beta with it's defrag unit active and now the frag is 0%.

Luc J. Patenaude - if it's this way then why 5.0 has showed all clear - no problems, no excluded files? These files have appeared only in 6.1 ;

- i didn't work so hard for 4 years to keep my system alive and kickin' to throw the towel because of a non lethal problem

- At this moment (and since i'm using the AWC beta) my frag is 0% on all 4 partitions

solbjerg - twice: from cmd and from AWC beta / System Utilities with the same result - absolutely no errors. BTW in HDDLifePro the hd health is at 100%.

This is how it looks http://i341.photobucket.com/albums/o368/Azrael-srl/SmartDefrag1.jpg and http://i341.photobucket.com/albums/o368/Azrael-srl/SmartDefrag3.jpg - attention, on the D partition everything is OK, i didn't screw anything. As you can see the black excluded files are there. What are they? Are they connected to the fact that i lost some free space without any reasonable explanation?

[Azrael]

It looks like this http://i341.photobucket.com/albums/o368/Azrael-srl/SmartDefrag4.jpg . I've run the Analyze again because the disk image after defrag has faded colours .

[solbjerg]

OK Azrael

Somewhat better, looks fair I think, I seem to remember that enoskype wrote that the Master File Table was fixed by Windows every three days.

The excluded files is often running applications, that isn't defragged while running.

The faded colours may come from letting System Analyze in AWC decrease the amount of colour used - to save resources. You can place that in the ignore list after restoring it to your preference in AWC.

 

Cheers

solbjerg

 

 

It looks like this http://i341.photobucket.com/albums/o368/Azrael-srl/SmartDefrag4.jpg . I've run the Analyze again because the disk image after defrag has faded colours .

[Azrael]

" The excluded files is often running applications, that isn't defragged while running. " That's what i wanted to know - it's not a problem but normal behaviour. Now all i need to do is to find where in hell my free space has gone . But this is my problem, not yours. Thanks

[solbjerg]

Right Azrael

Good luck!

Thanks for the feedback!

Cheers

solbjerg

 

" The excluded files is often running applications, that isn't defragged while running. " That's what i wanted to know - it's not a problem but normal behaviour. Now all i need to do is to find where in hell my free space has gone . But this is my problem, not yours. Thanks

[Luc J. Patenaude]

Seen your screenshots and, whew, what a mess to clean-up it likes.

 

" The excluded files is often running applications, that isn't defragged while running. " That's what i wanted to know - it's not a problem but normal behaviour. Now all i need to do is to find where in hell my free space has gone . But this is my problem, not yours. Thanks

 

Hint: Way to much space has already been taken away by 'Rarely Used' files and programs. Talk to all the other users of this machine and find out what are the most programs they are willing to use every day and, also called 'Frequently used' files and programs. These files and programs not being used at least once a week are in the purple color. You have to get rid of at least 90% of them for each and single one of your 4 partitions. It seems, now, to be horrendous choices to make but, this is what it is with Home-Made Networking.

:wink:

[mikesw]

Some files shouldn't be defragged or optimized.

 

Read this thread from another defragmentation program as to why

certain files can't be moved. MSofts defragger wont cause problems

since it knows that certain file[name]s can't be moved or very

serious problems can occur. Thus, other defragger programs have

to be made smart enough to account for these and skip over defragging

them or moving them (optimize); otherwise, your computer may not

bootup as it happened to this person. Thus, perfection in defragging

should be constrained.

 

http://forum.piriform.com/index.php?showtopic=17452

[enoskype]

Hi mikesw,

 

I have copied your above post into Think about Defragmentation!!! thread.

Useful information to be included there.

 

Thanks, and Cheers.

[GRASSU_]

" The excluded files is often running applications, that isn't defragged while running. "

 

I have the same problem in 1 computer and it is not from "running applications" because I boot-up my PC from BartPE-CD and the "excluded files" are still there. I have a lot of free space (30G) but because of these two many "excluded files" I can't defrag 1 file with only 500M. The normal XP-defrager don't "see" these files and fail too to defragment. I guess it's about encrypted files but I don't know how to find and delete these files. Any help ?

[enoskype]

Hi GRASSU,

 

Please follow guidance there for Sambac, and see if it helps.

 

Cheers.

[GRASSU_]

I have already read that. :( (did not help me)

[solbjerg]

hi grassu

I think I read somewhere that those bart's have a different identification tag. Could that be why it do not defrag?

Cheers

solbjerg

 

I have already read that. :( (did not help me)

[GRASSU_]

No. I just boot the PC with BartPE-CD because I wanted to be sure that no application/virus/driver don't use any file from that disk. Now I know how to find encrypted files and tomorow I will see if this is the problem...

(p.s. files from disk to defragment has no connection with BartPE)

[enoskype]

I understand from post #18 above that using Contig together with Power Defragmenter did not do the job, then it is most proably, as you say, because of the encryption of those files.

Even some of the well known paid defragmenters crashes and causes BSOD at the analysis phase because of encryption software and encrypted files.

[GRASSU_]

There was not encrypted files. The problem was "metadata" or "metafiles" (I can't remember exactly the name from Perfectdisk - who solved this "problem"). I hope this will help you to do a better product.

[enoskype]

There was not encrypted files. The problem was "metadata" or "metafiles" (I can't remember exactly the name from Perfectdisk - who solved this "problem"). I hope this will help you to do a better product.

 

 

Thank you for the feedback.

 

First of all, unfortunatelly I am not from IObit.

I am sure that they will do a better product than today in the future.

 

Secondly, it has been stated many times here in this forum that it will be very good if Smart Defrag had the functios of "Offline defrag" (defragmentation of system files on boot) and "Excluding files".

The files you have mentioned are MFT and/or Metadata files which are all excluded system files and can only be defragmented on boot.

The effect of the encryption software and files on defragmentation, mentioned in above post, are still valid.

 

Last but not least, I wish the relevant threads and posts of Defragmentation in this forum are read, where a lot of answers to questions can be found.

 

Cheers.

[GRASSU_]

I agree with you but I must clarify one more thing:

I don't know what is "metafiles" and I don't have time right now to google for that but they are not sytem files locked/used by OS.

- "offline" mode can be obtained when you boot from other drive (hard or optical). BartPe for exemple only use the files from CD and one virtual drive maked in memory (no read/write on harddisk).

- Perfectdisk defragment "metafiles" normally (not offline).

- so: these files are special but not because they are used by OS (some programs do not even see these files -like Auslogics, Powerdefrag/contig or normal windows defrag) (other programs, -like smartdefrag- see these files but can't do enything online or offline) (and other programs -like perfectdisk- do the job properly)

-I just hope that future versions of smartdefrag will solve the problem.

[solbjerg]

Hi grassu

In Windows Help there is an article about limitations of disk defragmenting.

A link is provided: http://msdn.microsoft.com/da-dk/magazine/cc302206(en-us).aspx

As far as I know Meta files are mostly used in image files both as bitmaps and vector files, and are mostly intended for portable media. i.e. WMF (icons and such -often)

Cheers

solbjerg

 

I agree with you but I must clarify one more thing:

I don't know what is "metafiles" and I don't have time right now to google for that but they are not sytem files locked/used by OS.

- "offline" mode can be obtained when you boot from other drive (hard or optical). BartPe for exemple only use the files from CD and one virtual drive maked in memory (no read/write on harddisk).

- Perfectdisk defragment "metafiles" normally (not offline).

- so: these files are special but not because they are used by OS (some programs do not even see these files -like Auslogics, Powerdefrag/contig or normal windows defrag) (other programs, -like smartdefrag- see these files but can't do enything online or offline) (and other programs -like perfectdisk- do the job properly)

-I just hope that future versions of smartdefrag will solve the problem.